My "new" 1980 CB650

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Solomoriah
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My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:15 pm

NOTE: I'm reposting this from another, less model-specific forum. I'm not going to edit the posts much, so please take into account that this spans over a larger period of time than you'd expect given the posting date.

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 4, 2016

I'm not going to call this a restoration, exactly. My daughter found this bike for sale on a local swap shop for $800.00... a bargain, for a running bike.

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Here's the other side, with my TW in the background:

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Note the mileage:

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Last edited by Solomoriah on Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:15 pm

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 4, 2016

These pictures are all as-we-found-it, incidentally.

The story has it that the original owner bought it new around 1980. The bike had inspection stickers in two places: high up on the left fork tube, hidden by the fairing, and on the lower left fork slider (as you may notice in the first pic). The lower inspection stickers are 1991, so I'm assuming that's the last year the first owner licensed it.

The original owner, I'm told, bought the bike for himself and his wife, and garaged it after she passed away. The fellow we bought it from acquired it a year or so ago, intending to ride it himself, but he lives on a gravel road; he scared himself rather badly, it seems, but it appears he did not actually drop the bike. The only damage is the broken right front turn signal, and the fairing has a ding and a crack that are consistent (in my opinion) with a garage fall... which the guy we bought it from said happened in a high wind.

As I say, he scared himself, and so decided to sell it. His choice of amount is what he needs to buy a shotgun, he said.

I took a test ride, and yeah, it's not much fun on gravel. It runs a bit puny at low RPM but revs pretty nicely; I'm suspicious of some gunk in the carbs, and hoping some fuel treatment will help (I don't relish pulling all four carbs and cleaning them).

The modifications are our main issues right now, though. There was a back rest on the bike when the last guy bought it, and he removed it; the bolts for the back rest are longer than the original grab bar bolts, so he did this:

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I know hex heads were standard, but I think I'll replace them with allen heads instead. I like the look, and they won't snag on clothing.

Then there are the engine guards, which are pure evil. Just try to shift:

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And then, I suppose you'd like to stop?

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Last edited by Solomoriah on Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:16 pm

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 4, 2016

My daughter spent some time cleaning up the bike, while I set about removing the unwanted parts. I rigged the fairing with a rope sling to the rafters in my garage so I wouldn't have to try to hold on to it while removing the bolts. It was a good thing, because the mounting frame was bent (and it looks as if it was bent when the fairing was installed, though I'm not 100% sure). After I got that off, I pulled the engine guards and one of the grab bar bolts (to use for sizing when I visit Fastenal next weekend).

The original headlight and signals are long gone, of course. Original style replacements aren't that hard to come by, but after some discussion we decided to go with a look-alike headlight instead along with some fairly nice OEM-like aftermarket signals. We should have them Wednesday or Thursday, and I'll post pics after we get them on.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:20 pm

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 5, 2016

So here it is stripped:

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The fairing installation did not, it appears, require cutting any of the stock wiring harness. It all looks pretty good:

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Here are the engine guards. I think they were meant for the non-Custom version of the bike; if the pegs and controls sat back a bit they wouldn't be in the way of operations. I may try to sell them... I'm sure not putting them back on.

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I put fuel system cleaner in the tank, filled it up and ran it some this morning. The treatment was intended for 21 gallons of gas (maximum); I used about a fifth of the bottle. It would probably be safe to use more than that, but I didn't want to overdo it. The bike seemed to start more easily this morning, but I have no idea why that would be true.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:23 pm

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 15, 2016

Had a hard time figuring out where the horn goes; it had been relocated when the fairing was put on, and the mounting point is missing from the fiche. I finally felt all around the front of the frame until I found the mounting point hidden behind all those wires.

The parts we ordered came in a couple of days ago, and I have the headlight mounts and turn signals on the bike. I had a hard time locating spacers that would work with the headlight and brackets, but finally found them at (ahem) aluminumspacers.com. The brackets we got would actually mount a full 8" headlight on the bike, but we got a 7" unit that is really, really nice looking; the mounting holes set back and in a bit, enough that you could actually mount the headlight on a bike fitted for a 6.25" headlight. As I say, though, it's a really nice unit. I'll post pics when it's all together (probably late next week).

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:25 pm

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 20, 2016

HOKAY DOKAY. So. Today I received the last items I needed to finish the job, and here it is:

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Here's another look at the headlight and signals, close up:

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In the credit-where-credit-is-due department, I have to give a big THANKS to Speed Moto Co. That's their headlight, headlight mounting brackets, and signals. Specifically, here are the items we used:

http://www.speedmotoco.com/product-p/smc-64313.htm
http://www.speedmotoco.com/headlight-bracket-p/144060.htm
http://www.speedmotoco.com/product-p/057-1-2009.htm

It probably would have been easier to get a headlight that had 7" mounting points, but I think I'd have needed spacers anyway, just less length. And this is a really nice looking headlight, in my opinion... does not look a bit cheap.

As I noted before, I got my spacers from aluminumspacers.com. If you visit their site, it looks like they only sell SAE parts, but actually there are metric parts mixed in with the nearest sizes of standard spacers... if I had not already found myself in the "ready to settle for less than perfect" situation, I might never have seen that they had the right thing. In fact, it's probably why it took me so long to find a good source. And this is a company that makes the parts in the US. Admittedly, they're just aluminum tubes, but still. I got two of the 19mm long, 19mm OD spacers:

http://www.aluminumspacers.com/spacers-by-hole-size/hole-for-3-8-inch-bolts/mas19-10-19

See, you can tell from the URL that they are in the 3/8" hole size category. I don't think they do themselves any favors, listing their parts the way they do, but the parts themselves are top notch.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:26 pm

ORIGINAL POST: Apr 25, 2016

Late last week I took the bike to get it inspected, and it failed... busted taillight, which I had not realized was bad enough to fail. Looking online, I found NOS lenses for $45.00. Seemed a bit high... instead, I ordered an entire taillight, not just the lens, for $26.00 including shipping on Ebay. This morning it passed inspection, and is now wearing a legal Missouri plate.

While riding it to and from the auto repair establishment where I got it inspected, I noticed the bike stumbled rather badly whenever I opened the throttle at highway speed (5000 RPM is about 55 MPH, and that's where I noticed it). I remembered seeing that the 1980 CB650 had a service bulletin, so I actually read it. Seems that some CB650s from that year had exactly that problem, and the fix from Honda was a part set that rerouted the float bowl vents to the airbox cover. The part number for that set is 17225-460-670, and just this moment there is a guy on Ebay selling such a kit for $60.00:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/361410947063?item=361410947063&lgeo=1&vectorid=229466&rmvSB=true

I'm too cheap for that. I stopped by the auto parts store and picked up some vacuum hose and a tee that looked pretty close to what is pictured, then drilled a hole in the airbox cover that is just a bit tight on the hose I bought. It's not perfect, but it did improve the bike's performance; before, if my hand twitched on the throttle, the bike would stumble, but now I have to roll it on more to get the stumble and it lasts a shorter period. May break down and buy the "right" part at some point... dunno. It's definitely serviceable as is.

I have noticed that it's not hard to hit a "false neutral" when upshifting. I'm learning to shift with more authority.

One thing that now puzzles me. I've been making the mistake all along that the CB650 came in a standard version which was not "cruiser" styled, and a Custom version that was. I see now that I was mistaken... both models have the same cruiser seating position, but the Custom has some nicer amenities (and Comstar wheels, which may or may not be "nicer" depending on whether or not you like those). The puzzlement comes from those dang engine guards... how could anyone ever want them on the bike, when they obstruct the foot controls? But the original owner of this bike obviously liked them.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:27 pm

ORIGINAL POST: May 8, 2016

Two weeks with a vintage Honda CB650

It's been going pretty well, actually. Several nickel-and-dime issues, such as a broken tachometer cable (the tach end rusted off; it was loose when I got the bike, and evidently got wet). I ordered new keys from [url='http://www.keys4urride.com']www.keys4urride.com[/url], and I have to say I was quite pleased with their service. The key number for my bike wasn't on the list on their site, but I emailed them and they said they could do it for me, so I ordered two. They work well.

The only present issue is the gas cap leak. The O-ring is missing from the cap, and Honda doesn't list it on the fiche as a separate part. I'm suspicious that it may be the part number 91258-300-013 (68X2.6) unit; I measure the space for the ring at 2 3/4", which is about 68mm. I'm probably going to have to just take the cap to a dealer to size it.

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:31 pm

OKAY, so, now a new post. I solved the gas cap problem by taking a piece of vacuum hose, slitting it lengthwise, filling it with contact cement, fitting it where I felt sure the seal was supposed to be, and then putting it on the tank to hold it all in place while the glue set. I put a thick film of motor oil on the tank first so the cement wouldn't stick, but sadly a bit of it got through and ate a small hole in the paint. It's not visible when the gas cap is in place, so I'm not going to cry too much about it... at this point, if I futz with it again I'll just replace the whole darn tank.

The bike still smells of gasoline if it sits very long. I'm putting it away with the petcock off, and that stops the smell. I'm suspicious of the float bowl vent hoses (the original ones), and when I get time I plan to pull the tank off and inspect them properly.

As I'm stating elsewhere, I think the tires are original (!!). They seem in good shape, but to be on the safe side I plan to replace them anyway.

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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby cb650 » Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:55 am

nicely done.
Did you clean the tank out?!?!?!?!

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:12 am

cb650 wrote:nicely done.

Thank you!

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Sun Mar 05, 2017 1:00 am

POSTING DATE: 5/8/16

Several nickel-and-dime issues, such as a broken tachometer cable (the tach end rusted off; it was loose when I got the bike, and evidently got wet). I got a replacement on Amazon.com, of all places.

I ordered new keys from www.keys4urride.com, and I have to say I was quite pleased with their service. The key number for my bike wasn’t on the list on their site, but I emailed them and they said they could do it for me, so I ordered two. They work well.

The only present issue is the gas cap leak. The O-ring is missing from the cap, and Honda doesn’t list it on the fiche as a separate part. I’m suspicious that it may be the part number 91258-300-013 (68X2.6) unit; I measure the space for the ring at 2 3/4″, which is about 68mm. I’m probably going to have to just take the cap to a dealer to size it.

POSTING DATE: 6/9/16

I mentioned the gas cap issues in my previous post. Well, here’s what I did: I took some of my excess vacuum hose, slit it open lengthwise, filled it with some strong contact cement, then put it over the slot (trough?) that the gas cap seal is supposed to fit into. I spread a little motor oil on the tank itself so the cap wouldn’t stick to it, then put the glued cap back on the bike. The idea was to hold the rubber hose in position until the glue set up.

It mostly worked. Unfortunately, a little bit of the glue made contact with the tank, and ate a couple of small spots of paint. Fortunately the damage is hidden under the cap, but it does irritate me that I didn’t foresee the possibility.

Sadly, however, it only partly fixed the problem. I know the cap was leaky because I could see gasoline vapor coming out and condensing on the tank with the cap in place; but, even with the new seal, it still smells of gasoline rather strongly.

Then I made another discovery, accidentally. I put the kickstand down in a slightly uneven parking spot; it didn’t go down right, and I dropped the bike (in slow motion… I was doing my best to stop it, but I just couldn’t). When I picked it back up, there was a spot of gasoline on the pavement.

I put two and two together and figured out that there must be a bad hose in among the carbs. Probably one of those float bowl vent hoses. I haven’t checked it out yet, but I have replacement hose on hand to fix it, hopefully soon. For the moment, I’ve been turning off the petcock when the bike is parked, and that solves the stinky gas problem.

While trying (and failing) to see where the leak is, I noticed some of the carb drain hoses were off their nipples. So of course, I tried putting them back on, but they just cracked. The hose is a different size than the hose I have on hand, necessitating a trip to the auto parts dealer. That, too, is a repair I haven’t done yet, but will get to soon.

Things made of rubber. Old rubber. But wait, there’s more.

To date I’ve put 650 miles on the bike, including maybe 50 on the Interstate at 65 MPH. Imagine my expression when I realized the previous owner never replaced the tires.

I was doing all that riding on thirty-six year old Cheng Shin tires. Egad.

I did the only sensible thing… I parked the bike and set out to order tires. Finding tires that would work on the CB650 was surprisingly hard; I hijacked a thread on this forum in the process, so if you care, you can find out how it went there:

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=12523

In the end I got Bridgestone Battlax BT45 tires; denniskirk.com had the 130/80-17 rear for $95.88 and the front for $93.88, which were bargains. I threw a couple of heavy duty IRC tubes and some Kenda rim strips into the cart (why doesn’t IRC have rim strips? Seems strange to me) and submitted the order.

Last night I put the tires on. It was a good time to try out my new Harbor Freight balancing stand, and it worked quite well. The front needed a single 10g weight, while the rear needed nothing (yeah, I didn’t believe it either, stood there spinning the tire over and over like I had some sort of neurological issue).

So. Progress. Still have some problems to beat with rubber hoses, but at least now I’m not afraid to ride it.

POSTING DATE: 2/26/17

I rode the CB650 maybe another 1,500 miles after the last post. The smell of gasoline got stronger each time; I found I had to put the bike away with the petcock closed or the garage filled up with fumes.

I finally quit riding it when I realized raw gas was leaking out of the carbs. I also discovered an oil leak, coming out around the shift shaft and dripping onto the left exhaust pipe. It was evidently leaking only while the bike was running, so there was no puddle in the garage to reveal the leak.

There was no avoiding it… my bike needed professional help.

I asked a fellow rider who owns a vintage Japanese bike who he would trust to do the work, and he recommended Cycle Tech at Fremont, Iowa. When I say “at” Fremont, I mean out in the middle of nowhere north of Fremont (which is itself somewhat like the middle of nowhere).

So I called up the man in charge and discussed my bike’s issues, and he shot me an estimate. It was more than I hoped, but less than I feared, and I took him up on it.

They pulled the carbs, fitted new gaskets and seals, put ’em back together and synced them up. They also replaced the bad seal on the shift shaft… problem solved.

Things made of rubber, you know?

I didn’t think to ask them to change the oil, but I picked up oil and a new oil filter when I went back to get the bike.

So anyway, moving on… last weekend I set out to change the oil in the CB650. Draining it was easy, but the oil filter bolt head was pretty chewed up. I couldn’t get a wrench to grab it, nor would my hex-head vice grips do it.

Finally I put curve-jaw vice grips on it, clamped down as tight as I could get them, and tapped on the vice grips with a rubber mallet. After a few judicious whacks, the bolt broke loose, and I was able to complete the job.

I considered getting a replacement OEM bolt (Honda part number 15420-333-000), but the few places that had them listed the price at around $55.00. There had to be a better solution… and there is. I discovered that Emgo makes a replacement oil filter bolt for the CB650, and it has a 17mm head instead of the 12mm head on the stock unit. Should be harder to round it off. The Emgo part number is 11-46400; Amazon.com has it for $14.97 with free shipping, which is much better than the OEM part price. K&L Supply also makes a replacement for this bolt, their part number 19-1387, available on Amazon.com for $15.93 + $8.74 shipping; still a better deal than the OEM part. Of course, these prices are just good for right now, and will surely change in the future.

Just for the record, I checked some other vendors for this part. Dennis Kirk has it for $16.95 plus shipping. Rocky Mountain ATV/MC does not seem to have it, which I suppose isn’t that odd given their obvious off-road focus, except that they do have many other parts for the CB650 including the K&N oil filter, and they carry other Emgo parts. Didn’t find the K&L bolt on either site.

For the moment I’m going to use the existing bolt, but when the bike is due for another oil change I’ll get a replacement.

While changing the oil, I thought about other periodic maintenance items, and decided I should service the air cleaner as well. I pulled it out and discovered it was soaked with old gasoline. I knew the bike had backfired from time to time, especially when cold or running on choke, so I assumed it had been blowing gas back into the airbox. (I’m hoping that sealing the carbs has fixed the backfire issue.)

Well, then. Time for a new air cleaner. I ordered an Emgo replacement, part number 12-90700, on Amazon.com here. The current price is $10.69 with free shipping. The Honda OEM number is 17211-460-000. Note that they completely changed the airbox and filter in 1980. If you have the 1979, this information won’t apply to you.

The replacement filter came in, so I set about installing it. There’s a rubber seal that fits around the flange on the filter; you have to take it off the old filter and put it on the new one. While I stood there putting the seal on the new filter I noticed a shine from inside the airbox. A wet shine, to be exact. I figured it must be some more gasoline. I grabbed a big handful of paper towel and stuffed it into the airbox, then pulled it back out soaked with sour gas. Did this twice more before I was sure I had it all… I was surprised how much was in there.

I went ahead and installed the new air cleaner and buttoned up the bike. I now had a pile of gas-soaked paper towels… kind of a fire hazard, obviously. I stuffed the paper towels into the box the new air cleaner came it, took the whole mess out to the driveway and set it on fire. After a moment’s thought, I put the old gas-soaked air cleaner on top.

It all burned down to ash in about half an hour. I fished the metal bits from the air cleaner out and threw them in the trash (after ensuring they were no longer hot enough to be dangerous), then stamped around on the ashes to disperse them. All cleaned up.

I’m almost afraid to say it, but I think the bike is done. I’ll try to remember to post some pictures soon!

Theodore1996
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Theodore1996 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 5:14 pm

I am wondering how the headlight you bought has been working out, I literally bought a 1980 CB650, with all the same issues as yours for 200$. I want to removed that fairing from the front, but I want to order the right stuff the first time. Also did the headlight come with any bolt to attach it to the brackets, or did you have to get them separate?

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Solomoriah
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Re: My "new" 1980 CB650

Postby Solomoriah » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:24 pm

The headlight did not come with bolts; I had to find my own. I can't find my notes from where I got them, but I seem to recall they were M10-1.25 or something like that. The hard thing to find were the spacers, and I've given a link to them above.

As to how I'm getting along with it... I'll be honest, it's a good looking unit but it's not the best headlight I've ever had. The pattern seems a bit wonky somehow. Might just be me.


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